Meet the Counselors
Margaret McCray, Leta Herrington, Stephen Lander

The Rev. Dr. Margaret McCray, LMFT, Executive Director, Westminster Counseling Center

After seminary and ordination in the Presbyterian Church (USA) in 1981, I spent 8 years as a campus minister on a large commuter campus in Fort Wayne, Ind. My interest in counseling was further solidified in these years, and I completed my doctor of ministry degree in pastoral psychotherapy in 1989. After 5 years on a church staff as a pastoral counselor, I moved to Minneapolis and took a position at the Westminster Counseling Center (WCC). Since then I have been privileged to work with outstanding colleagues and to experience the satisfaction of accompanying people as they face life's challenges.

Pastoral counseling. As a pastoral counselor I bring my learning and commitments in the fields of clinical psychology and theology into the practice of psychotherapy. My concern in working with clients is their emotional and spiritual health. (I use “spiritual” as an intentionally ambiguous word.)
In my work as a pastoral counselor, I see many people in one-on-one therapy. I also see people in the context of a couple: married, engaged, dating, in committed partnerships, or looking at the possibility of divorce/separation. Sometimes counseling is most beneficial when a whole family comes in together. And here at WCC we also offer group therapy, an especially rewarding context for learning, growing and changing.

Clinical perspectives. I have come to respect several schools of understanding about emotional health and illness, specifically object relations theory, cognitive/behavioral theory, systems theory, and mindfuIness/self-awareness. I also have received Level II training in EMDR. I explore with each client to discover how best to mix these tools and perspectives to favorably impact our work together.
I begin by hearing the problem as the client sees and knows and experiences it. I listen to what they want and need from our work, and together we formulate a set of goals. Getting to know a client is the beginning of our work, although current crises are always dealt with first. I take a history to become familiar with the events, persons, relationships, memories and feelings and self-understanding that have brought the client to be the person I am meeting today. If I am working with more than one person, we do a version that includes everyone in the process. Then we work from the here-and-now, with knowledge of the past to give us some depth, to encounter what is the present problem.
In our conversations during appointments – which may be weekly or less often if that seems advisable – I look for ways to enhance a person’s understanding of
• how their relationships might become easier to manage and more pleasant to experience;
• how they themselves might become more aware of their own  contributions to the problem they are experiencing;
• what they might do to change their negative part in the problem;
• how they might more positively and successfully communicate with those around them;
• what they want from their interactions with others and what that might say about their own health and well-being; and
• what lies deeper within them that either enhances or complicates the way they experience their life.
Our histories and families shape us and we carry that shape into the world of adulthood and responsibility. I like to talk about that shaping as the ‘suitcase’ our parents packed for us that we carry with us when we leave home. All parents, even the best parents, unintentionally pack some ‘bricks’ in their children's suitcases. Some of us leave home with more bricks than others. But once we are adults we have the choice/responsibility to remove those bricks as we become aware of them. Rather than be burdened by their unneeded weight we can leave our trail of bricks by the side of the road.
When a life circumstance awakens us to our need for more understanding and support than we can find among our own resources, we have an opportunity to look more closely through our suitcase in the context of counseling and make discoveries that can lighten our load. Leaving some of those bricks behind can be the beginning of a new sense of self. Looking through our suitcase with some curiosity and self-awareness can also reveal gifts we may not have let ourselves recognize before. These gifts, when acknowledged and lived into, become a source of enlightenment, joy and gratitude.
This is not to say that talking to a pastoral counselor is all about looking at the past. As I have indicated above, most often the past is best understood and revisited by paying attention to the present, to the relationships and emotions that are part of our everyday lives.

Theological perspectives. People come to Westminster Counseling Center from other towns and cities, other congregations, even other faith traditions. We welcome and respect the traditions and beliefs that sustain them and give them hope.
One's experience of the Sacred Other, whether God, Mystery, a Higher Power, or in some cases one's philosophy of life, is sooner or later often a topic of conversation in the course of therapy. In that eventual conversation I am always curious, intensely respectful, and ready to be affirming of the health I see.
I do not believe that all people must share the same understanding of God. I do believe that a healthy faith acknowledges a God of love, a God of mercy and compassion, a forgiving God who invites us into relationship. When a religious belief or philosophy of life has become the occasion for shame, anger and doubt I see that as a time to listen, to be patient and understanding, and to encourage questions and exploration. Faith or belief becomes a supporting matrix for what we give ultimate meaning. A healthy and life affirming matrix is essential for the nurture of a healthy self and relationships.
Life is a conversation with oneself, others, and for many of us, with a higher power. Counseling is a conversation with another that is uniquely privileged. It is confidential. It is protected by professional boundaries. It is limited in time and space. It is sacred reality, in other words, an hour of liminal space that is not ‘in the world.’ Our conversation may be of the everyday world, but it takes place in a setting that is uniquely not ‘everyday.’ That is the power of the therapy relationship.
In the past decade I have found great nourishment, hope and practical wisdom in the teachings of Buddhism. Although I am a Christian, my understanding of how God works in and through relationships, nature, and the "isness" of all life is daily enhanced by Buddhist philosophy. Coming awake and being aware of the present moment that we inhabit, not the past we once were or the future that has not yet arrived, is a powerful gift of being that I encourage myself and others to appreciate.
I feel and know that my faith and experience of God's presence in my own life gives me a resilience that I call on daily in my work. Sharing the intimate lives of others who have the courage to ask for help and guidance is a gift that I never take for granted. I learn from every person I meet in the sacred space of the counseling office. What I learn becomes part of what I offer, and in this I feel I give glory to the Creator. Back to top of page

The Rev. Dr. Leta J. Herrington, LPC

 Responding to a powerful experience of Grace, I entered seminary with a felt sense of call to work alongside people as opposed to preaching to them from on high. Ordained as a Presbyterian minister in 1983, I served as pastor in two parishes in Texas and Pennsylvania before beginning my doctoral studies in pastoral counseling. I have served as a pastoral counselor for the past 20 years in State College, Pa.; in Lincoln, Ill., where I directed a counseling center; and most recently in Minneapolis at Westminster Counseling Center, working primarily with individuals, couples and groups, and at Fairview Ministerial Health, where I work with clergy and clergy spouses.

A native of Nebraska, I have degrees from Nebraska Wesleyan University (B.S. in Psychology), Louisville Presbyterian Theological Seminary (M. Div.), and Lancaster Theological Seminary (D. Min. in Pastoral Counseling). In addition, I completed the residency program at Illinois Pastoral Institute, am a Licensed Professional Counselor in Minnesota, a Fellow with the American Association of Pastoral Counselors and have received Level II training in EMDR.

My approach to counseling. It has been my experience that when we find ourselves in a hole, people/friends/advisors generally respond in one of three ways:

(1) They stand at the top of the hole and yell down to us, “Why don’t you just…take a walk…get out more…get over it…be more like me.”  And then they walk away.

(2) They jump down into the hole with us, are willing to listen, hold our hand, agree that it’s awful, and sometimes end up stuck and feeling awful with us.

(3) They jump down into the hole with us, are willing to listen, seek to understand what the hole is like for us, how we landed in there, and then help in identifying and taking the steps to get up and out of the hole.

My approach is the latter one and is based on a belief that God created and is actively at work in the people I see and the process before us. Making use of Compassion, concepts from developmental and self psychology, Wisdom and Hope, object relations, systems theories and Grace, I work to determine with clients where their Growth has gotten stuck, distorted or shamed, and to clear the path that they are free to function in more satisfying ways.

My understanding of healing. I liken an emotional or spiritual wound to a badly scraped knee. If, in the case of the knee, it is cleaned and washed out well, ointments and bandages applied, and is periodically checked and treated through the healing process, generally with time it will heal. If, however, the scraped knee is ignored altogether or is hastily wiped off and a bandage slapped on, if the dirt and gravel are not cleaned out before the wound starts to cover over, most assuredly the knee will become infected, and if still left unattended, the infection will spread. What started out as a fairly simple hurt knee can develop into an entire leg becoming infected and sensitive to touch. If still left unattended the wound and its infection can become life threatening.

I believe the same is true of emotional and spiritual wounds. If they’re not adequately responded to and cared for at the time they occur, these wounds most likely will fester and with time will inevitably affect more and more of a person’s perceptions, decisions, relationships and life.

The problem with spiritual or emotional hurts is that while they are real and can become quite disabling, they can’t be seen. Unfortunately, it seems that because they can’t be seen, they are often left untreated. Even more unfortunate, a person with an ‘unseen’ struggle is often ridiculed rather than supported.

I do not believe that time heals. To suggest to a person with depression, grief, past abuses, hurts, or losses that they should “just get over it” without tending to them is like advising a person with a broken leg to “just get over it” without setting the leg, or like telling a person with blocked arteries that “they should be over it by now” though surgery was never performed. The healing of physical as well as emotional wounds takes both time and proper care.

I see pastoral counseling as an experience of two or more gathering in God’s name, and consequently an experience of God, Grace, Insight, Wisdom, Power, Possibility, Freedom, and Hope being there also. Often it is a process that requires time, care, and tracking an emotional or spiritual infection back to its original wound so that healing can begin to take place. It is a relationship and a process that we’re all likely to benefit from at some point during our life journey and certainly an honor for me when I’m invited to work alongside a person for this part of their journey. Back to top of page

The Rev. Stephen K. Lander, LMFT, M.A., LP

I was drawn to Westminster Counseling Center as a place where I could integrate two important aspects of my professional life – my secular skills as a mental health practitioner and my spiritual vocation that includes pastoral counseling & spiritual direction.    Working at WCC offers a unique opportunity to invite questions and exploration of each person’s spiritual journey in whatever manner seems most appropriate to the client.  

There is a rich tradition of psychological transformation included in the vocabulary of pastoral counseling.  We use concepts such as reconciliation, repentance, grace, forgiveness, hope, gratitude, faith, and an awareness of providence as part of the dialogue about everyday human problems.   We use metaphors like being lost and then found, blind and being able to see again, death and rebirth, being in exile and a return to the promised land, when we talk about strategies for change.

I bring over 25 years of experience in the field of mental health, with special areas of interest related to family therapy, children, and adolescents.  I work with a diverse population of clients - young & old, gay & straight, couples & families, groups & individuals, for I find that it is by embracing the full spectrum of life experience that my practice is enriched, and my experience continues to grow. 

My graduate education occurred during a time when I was living in the San Francisco Bay area, and at this point in my life I was very involved with Depth Psychology and Jungian analysis.   Jung’s ideas incorporated the spiritual dimension of human experience unlike most other psychological theories, and I found the exploration of dreams, journaling, and sandplay all to be helpful tools.   Dora Kalff, the Swiss Jungian analyst who developed Sandplay therapy believed in the natural healing power of the Psyche and understood that the role of the therapist is to create a free and protected space in which the client can explore his/her concerns.  She understood the fantasy worlds created in the sandtray as being outward manifestations of the inner world of the client

 Most of the training I received in the Jungian community was focused primarily on the interior life of the individual, and as my interest in working with abused and traumatized children developed I became more and more aware of the importance of family systems thinking.   The importance of the influence of our early caregivers has long been acknowledged in psychological theory, but the family therapy theorists were the first to understand that symptoms are also maintained by present-day patterns of interactions.  Because of this, they were much more interested in creating change in the emotional environment of the family – through both cognitive reframing and concrete behavioral interventions. 

Currently I am most interested in the work of Narrative Therapy, and especially the writings of Michael White.  Here is an example of how he talks about the therapeutic encounter: “My lifelong fascination for maps has led me to look at them as a metaphor for my work with people who consult me about a range of concerns, dilemmas, and problems.  When we sit down together I know that we are embarking on a journey to a destination that cannot be precisely specified and via routes that cannot be predetermined.  I know that we will probably take some extraordinarily scenic routes to these unknown destinations.  I know that as we approach these destinations we will be stepping into other worlds of experience.  And I know that the adventures to be had on these journeys are not about the confirmation of what is already known, but about expeditions into what is possible for people to know about heir lives. “

  The stories that we tell (or that are told about us) are especially important to those who advocate for an understanding of the world through the postmodern lens of Narrative Theology & Narrative Therapy.   This way of seeing the world is concerned with who controls the story (or Narrative).   The most influential story is usually told from the point of view of the dominant culture.  But there are other stories, or “local knowledges” most often told by those who are less privileged. 
 The stories we tell about our lives can be very important tools in developing ways for us to talk to one another about the experiences of our faith journeys, and/or the problems we encounter in family life.   The writer, Krista Tippett, says that the constructs of Narrative Theology gave her, “the notion that everyone has relevant observations to make about the nature of God and ultimate things  - that the raw material of our lives is the stuff of which we construct our sensibility of meaning and purpose in this life, of how the divine intersects or interacts with our lives, of what it means to be human.  She says, “There is a profound difference between hearing someone say this is the truth, and hearing someone say, this is my truth.   You can disagree with another person’s opinions; you can disagree with his doctrines; you can’t disagree with his experience.”
In Pastoral counseling we are concerned about the stories people tell, and who gets to tell them – in other words, who’s story is it, really.   We often use the tools of Narrative Therapy to help people develop a bigger picture of the life experiences that surround a given problem, and to explore new uncharted ways of understanding.    Problems often tend to take on a life of their own and can become a major focus of a person’s experience, so the telling of one’s whole story is a way to expand the discourse and to place problems in a context which includes a broader understanding of the experiences that make up our lives.  Back to top of page